Although the judiciary is considered in some quarters to have lost its vibrancy in 2011 due to the crisis that rocked the two most senior judicial officers in the land, many stakeholders are still of the view that the judiciary performed creditably well by remaining the bastion of democracy through its landmark judgments, despite the fact that there are still rooms for improvement. In this interview with BERTRAM NWANNEKANMA, the chairman of the Swift Count, a coalition of four large civil society election monitoring groups in Nigeria, and Delta State former Attorney-General and Commissioner of Justice, Dafe Akpedeye, who is also a Senior Advocate of Nigeria (SAN), applauded the judiciary for keeping the society's fabrics through its landmark judgments. But he regretted that some of the courts gave discordant judgments on the same issues sometimes with courts with coordinate jurisdiction. He also spoke on the security challenges in the land, among others. Excerpts:HOW do you assess the judiciary in 2011 as a senior lawyer who has played a major role in the sector'The judiciary has been at the forefront in moving our democracy forward in 2011 even though it has its own ups and downs. There have been a couple of landmark judgments, some of which have taken people out from the embedded cul-de-sac, orders that installed new candidates and orders that asked for new elections. Indeed, the judiciary has become the bastion of democracy. This is a proof by these judgments that a lot of shenanigan that happened in our electoral process in the past had been corrected. I hope that as we forage in 2012, and indeed in the subsequent elections, the judiciary will continue in that direction so as to make the electoral process, probably, more transparent.What will you consider as the high point of the judiciary in 2011'There are couple of landmark judgements, some of which affected a few governors. Some also installed candidates, the last and most important being that the confirmation by the Supreme Court of the election of President Goodluck Jonathan as the winner of the April election. It was a unanimous decision of all the justices of the Supreme Court and as it were, affirming the decision of the majority of Nigerians. That decision of the court clearly showed that we are now moving from the era where elections were mere selection process and as it were, to be more transparent in Nigeria. To me, that is the highest point of judiciary, where the apex court put the entire need of the country into consideration, because if they had said otherwise, we do not know what the country would have become. So for me, it was the most important judgment in 2011.What are your reactions to Gen. Muhammadu Buhari's allegation against INEC for denying him access to electoral materials that would have helped him to prove his case'Let me state here that you can never have a perfect election. Even the Americans, who have been at it for 200 years still, have people being accused of rigging. What I feel is important in determining the fairness of any election is the overall conduct of the election. Was it such as to mar the decision, the mind and will of the people' The CPC had complaints and they went to court, the court in its wisdom said whatever transpired in the general election was not enough as to affect the outcome of the result. I don't want to start casting aspersion on who said this or not. The result is there for all to see, the question is this: was CPC large enough as to make an impact to the generality of Nigerians' Did the CPC have the presence all over the country as to win the presidential election' We have a popular saying in this part of the country that if the witch cries in the night and the child dies the following morning, there is always a close correlation between who killed the child and the cry of the witch. The result of the election is open for all to see and that has been endorsed and corroborated by the highest court of the land, which said the election was free and fair.Don't you consider the squabbles between the former Chief Justice of Nigeria and the then President of Court of Appeal as the sore point of the judiciary in 2011'The only way gold can be beautiful is when it is purified by fire. You have to get the sore point to get better in life. In the Bible, there were 12 apostles, 11 of them were impeccable, but what do you hear the most' It is the only one who strayed that you hear the news all the time. Whenever you gather 12 people or more, you have a Judas. Everything in life has its challenges, but that alone is not enough to mar the entire process or the entire motive of people, which made up the entire judiciary. My attitude to the judiciary is that as we evolve over time as a people, we will get better, because that is the only way every function needs to feel like. Truly speaking, those challenges will come and go, but like they say, 'soldier come, soldier go, barrack will remain'. There is no way the judiciary will not get better, because it behoves on the whole system to do right, in trying to achieve the fundamental goods and growth of the nation.Some senior lawyers are of the view that the treatment meted to Justice Ayo Salami was not right and are even calling for his reinstatement. What is your reaction to that'I am careful not to discuss the matter that is subjudice. As a Senior Advocate of Nigeria (SAN), I should know the fact that in a matter that is still in court, you don't give pronouncement on that when decision has not been made public, so as not to prejudice the mind of the judges. Let me leave the matter. Justice Salami has gone to court asking for his rights to be vindicated, let the court do its job in that regard. Like every other Nigerian, I have my personal opinion about what transpired between them. Let me leave my personal opinion and wait for the outcome of the matter in court to vindicate him.How will you assess the election in 2011 vis a vis, Prof. Attahiru Jega's appointment and the issues that were thrown up during the election as a member of the NBA's election working group and chairman of the Swift Count'As a student of history, let me dovetail back to 2003 and eventually, 2007 and indeed, 2011, when we came to the polls. Election under Prof. Maurice Iwu in 2007, to say the least, was an aberration and nothing to write home about. Prof. Jega came with a lot of pedigree, an avalanche of credibility. He has been a critic and a leader of the Academic Staff Union of Universities (ASUU), and he came with a lot of panache into the job. Had he lived up to his billing' By and large, yes, because elections in 2011, as acknowledged by all and indeed, by international and the Commonwealth observers, had been most credible and fair ever in this country. Though it was not perfect, it was a monumental improvement from what he had before now. We are still bedevilled with the late arrival of materials, because having been at the end of this process; we are still bedevilled with a lot of things that it is not at its perfect stage. It is an incremental move from where we are before; we are getting a lot better. Indeed, the international observers did say in the report that whatever discrepancies we had in the election was not such as to mar the process. So the process was fair and to say the least, credible.What do you like to see in the judiciary in 2012'I will like to see a judiciary that will be respected by all and sundry; because right now, there are a lot of inconsistent pronouncements. We have different divisions of the Court of Appeal where judgments of the High Courts go to and indeed most election matters, stay or stop at. If a division gives a judgment, some other divisions should follow that. When there is a pronouncement, the lower court sees that pronouncement and gets strength, if they want to change it, there is a process to change that. Now, when the different divisions of Court of Appeal give, as it were, different and conflicting judgments, then people now think and choose which one to support, that creates inconsistency in the process. The legal community need to evolve a process where we know exactly what has been pronounced on and even if there is need to deviate from it, let it be clear so that there is no two subsisting judgments at the same time, that is when people will have confidence in the process and belief on what it said. That is the kind of judiciary I am looking for in 2012.Are you comfortable with the attempt by the CJN to reform the process'The journey of a thousand miles, according to the Chinese, starts with a step. The only thing constant in life is change. We must change and change for the better. The CJN, perhaps, acknowledges there is need to change and reform to get better. The challenge is for him to be transparent, so that there is no embedded interest in effecting the change. I think that is the position of the Nigerian Bar Association (NBA), which as a faithful member, I totally subscribe to.Are you surprised with the disagreement among members of the committee set up by the CJN in that regard'Human nature has embedded interest. Every time people have subjective opinions, so naturally you expect people to have varying points and disagreements in that regard. What is important is the process of appointing those who go to the committee, once it is transparent and everybody is comfortable with the process, they will abide by the decisions. So that even if an interest has been taken up, it will be to achieve the desired purpose. Of course, we have challenges, perhaps, that is the teething problem, which you need to overcome, which is being worked on and in the fullness of time, I believe and hope we will scale all these hurdles to get to where we want to go to.What is your view on the clamour for reforms in the appointment of judges to our courts'Any system, which does not give cognisance of merit, is not the very best. There is a constitutional provision that a lawyer who has been in law practice for 10 years is qualified. It is better to throw it open to everybody that is qualified. But when you said that the only way to get to the highest court in the land is through a particular process, then you don't get the very best. While you cannot take away experience and age, you cannot also take away agility, speed and brilliance. A blend of both will give us the very best and take us where we want to be in this country. The current system appears not to have worked perfectly and that is why there is a clamour for a change. But as you know, change is very difficult to come by, especially when people get comfortable with a process, and if they are benefiting from that process also.Do you think that the present security challenge in the country can be tackled through laws'Any other way without the backing of the law will bring anarchy. The problem is not that our laws are not effective but it is the implementation of these laws, which is what gives efficacy to the laws. Look at the Boko Haram issue for instance, there is punishment for arson, it is the commitment and the will of the leadership to implement that is the problem. I think with the seriousness of which this has caused this country and the likely consequences of doing nothing about it, I don't see it happening too long.Do you then feel that dialogue may not solve the problem as suggested by some people'I have a problem with that suggestion and this is being very altruistic. The Niger Delta crisis was totally different with what we have now. The demands of the Niger Delta people were definite and clear. If I may ask, what do the Boko Haram activists want' For lack of better word really, what do we need to negotiate with Boko Haram' If what they want is to Islamise Nigeria, is it really possible' The day you make that concession that they are allowed to Islamise Nigeria, that day, you would have given away the sovereignty of Nigeria. That, for me, is a non-starter and the biggest betrayal of trust given to our leaders in the country. I don't see an option. Honestly, I have thought about it, I don't see how truly you can negotiate with people, who have a demand that is totally unreasonable.How best do you think government can handle this problem'There is no problem in this world that does not have a solution. The law of gravity says, everything that goes up, must come down. Government is even not punishing those that are identifiable, even when the governor of Niger State said we know these people'I have a problem with a statement like that. If you say you know the people, give us verifiable proofs. He should tell us who these people are. I believe no reasonable leadership of any country that will say, I know people, who are responsible for killing people and will do nothing about it. We need to be careful of speculation of heinous crimes like this. You can be sympathetic to a course but that does not make you a sponsor of that course. The problem is heinous enough, but I see a lot of security moves in trying to unearth some of all these things. The only empirical data, government has now, lead to the arraignment of Senator Ndume and you can see the stiff bail conditions he was given. It is indicative to me that the government of the day is not resting on their oars, but you know when a man is willing to die for a purpose, it is very difficult to stop. Our security agencies should increase their capacities of nipping things in the bud before they get out of hand.There had been some skirmishes in Delta State of recent. Do you think that is it a form of reprisal attack to the Boko Haram menace'My advice to the government of the day is to take the issue of security more seriously, because if there is no order, there will no government. The government only stays in a position when there is a level of order. Things like reprisal attacks are not acceptable, two wrongs never make a right, vengeance is of God and not of man.What is your position on the removal of fuel subsidy by the government'The issue of fuel subsidy has been with us for a very long time. If you listen to the government's argument on it though not well-articulated, what I can gather from it is that we are at the bankrupt point. If that is true, then we don't have a choice. I think the challenge the government has is the sincerity of purpose. If people believe that we are really at bankrupt point, they will have no choice but to tighten their belts.The simple caveat is, can we trust government that if we save all these money it will go for the required purpose' We can only learn from our antecedents. If you are telling me that we are in dire need, then you must live by example. But if you tell me that we cannot afford it, then I see you living in opulence, increase your expense profile, then there is a problem. That, I think is the greatest challenge. The government needs to cut its expenses honestly, truthfully and transparently, then the followership.
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